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: 3/18/2009

I love the Daily Sound and I genuinely appreciate the depth and balance of the local coverage it generates. I also appreciate the timeliness of stories like this one and understand the stress of deadlines. That being said, the Sound really needs an editor to proof read copy with an eye for detail. In the article above, for example, the board members name's are Panizzon (not Panizzan) and Hickey-Banks (not Hickeybanks). I would bet the farm that Paul Midell is really Paul Medel. There are also a couple of grammatical issues but they are less troublesome than reporting names incorrectly. This may seem like a minor complaint but journalistic credibility depends on details. And many locals here want the Sound to continue to grow in circulation and respect.

passing-by

squeeky wheel whiners : 3/18/2009

According to the Lib of Congress, by 2080 only %8 of everybody running around calling themselves 'American indian' will be one-half Indian, or better. Yes, the genocides against the American Indian, combined with out-breeding will extinct the blood pool by the year 2100AD. Many reservations will revert back to being the USA. Why people want California to be like Cuba, where there is little evidence of a previous civilization, is a wonder to me.

Hurtful images : 3/18/2009

I was present for the meeting yesterday, and I'm very disappointed in the outcome. These images clearly hurt children who attend this school. Current schoolchildren should be the top priority at a high school, not other townspeople or former graduates who feel a connection to the "tradition" of these images. Leaving these images as they are after the outcry by students who find them offensive to their own identity and sense of self sends the messages that "tradition" is more important than how current students feel and that it is acceptable to deprecate the culture of a particular group of people. Yesterday at the meeting, we began with a flag salute. The end of that salute states: "with liberty and justice for all." I do not feel that the decision yesterday supported the commitment made in the flag salute. There is no liberty and no justice when any among us are downtrodden and neglected. I stand with Eli Cordero.

an observer

Carpinteria retains its racist imagery : 3/18/2009

Paul Midell did more than attack Eli's Indianness. After claiming to be Cherokee, he said, "You better be careful what you wish for because soon there won't be any mascots to remember you by." Not only did he switch his identity position, referring to Indians as "you" not "us," but his comment implicitly condones genocide. I'm completely baffled how so many adults are so attached to a HIGH SCHOOL mascot.

shocked

Get Real! : 3/19/2009

Oh please how do these images "clearly hurt children who attend the school" - tell that to the children who have observed the images since 1928 and are now successful members of the community! You insult the children to say this, as if they are a bunch of victims and weaklings that can't discern the difference between an image and reality. I am proud of the former Carp High members who see the P.C. B.S. for what it is and stand to fight against it! How does an accurate depiction of a warrior interfere with anyone's liberty and justice and make them downtrodden?? What a society of crybabies and whiners we have become! And worse yet, we are teaching children to be victims, that they do not have a chance because of "racism", and to pout and complain instead of doing something positive for themselves and the community! Teach them that if they whine and complain they can get what they want. Teach them to be complainers instead of rising above their circumstances and overcoming them ! It is your OWN fault if you allow others to dictate your circumstances and your lot in life. Those who stand behind Eli are sending the wrong message to children, and hurting them much worse than these images ever could do ! Teach them to be strong and deal with the cards they are dealt instead of blaming everyone else for your problems and crying about it.

Aaron Shaw

American Indian : 3/19/2009

Oh please! I am part american Indian. I personally do not feel that this is a degrogative thing to be callled. One of the meanings of Warrior: a person who shows or has shown great vigor, courage, or aggressiveness, as in politics or athletics. Would someone be offended if they were called "A true warrior in the fight against cancer"? No! Redskins maybe but a warrior? Come on !

Hey Eli : 3/19/2009

The warrior depictions are of plains Indians they have nothing more to do with you than they do of me so mind your own business! This is like a white person being offended that a depiction of a Colonial settler is on the dollar bill! Give me a break !

John Stossel

Vikings, Spartans, Trojans, 49ers... : 3/20/2009

We live in a culture where some people exist to be offended. My understanding of these images and the term "Warriors" is that they represent positive traits -- things like courage and bravery. Yes, "Warriors" refers to tribes of Indians from a bygone era. So? There is nothing offensive or improper about that. Nobody seems to become offended when similar terms are used that reference whites or people of European ancestry. Why is it that I never see a columnist advocating the elimination of the words "vandal" or "barbarian" from our language? Both words refer to specific peoples and carry negative connotations. I haven't seen outrage from the Nordic community regarding the Minnesota Vikings; the Greeks regarding the Michigan State Spartans, or; Italians about the U.S.C. Trojans. I wonder why.

Loud Whispers

Response to racist posts : 3/21/2009

It really concerns me to see all of these people writing "oh, please," and "give me a break," in response to the outcry about the mascot. It's clear that we need to facilitate education about racism in this community. The problem with the Warrior mascot and other imagery is not that there is anything "wrong" with being a "warrior" per se. Of course, it conveys connotations of particular traits that many people think are honorable. And, just because someone is part Native American and doesn't have a problem with it doesn't mean that another person, Native American or not, might find it offensive. Here is the problem: we all know of the history of Native American genocide that occurred on this continent. As a result, Native Americans today are a small minority of our population. Today many people do not know accurate information about the details of Native American histories or about the cultural practices significant to many Native Americans in contemporary times. The mascot reduces all of this complexity to a single image and makes it seem as though athletes can somehow "embody" "Native American warrior" qualities, an assumption which is akin to many other stereotypes that people have of particular communities. My friends who are Asian, for instance, are not thrilled to be portrayed as the "model minority" or "good at math," even though other people might think that these are "good qualities." These, too, are stereotypes. But clearly my reasoning makes no difference to people whose main objective is to hold onto this mascot. Well, in that case, do you care more about a mascot than real, live people who tell you that the imagery offends them? If so, please take a close look at your answer and think about how you could be more compassionate to others. In this situation, high school students TELL us that the images are problematic and deeply trouble them. Don't you think we should do something about that instead of pretend that these are just complainers with no real point? It's obvious to anyone who listens that this is not just a plea for attention but a real, visceral, emotional issue. Please consider, just for a moment even, that they might have a point.

Disappointed

Waaaaahhhhhhhhh : 3/22/2009

I can remember when words such as "racist" and "stereotype" actually meant something. Over the years, however, people with a lesser capacity for reason began using these terms in ad hominem fashion, attempting to shout down "diverse" opinions; that trend continues today. A high school's use of plains Indian imagery and the term "Warrior" bear no relation to anything but the obvious; it's the school mascot. In fact, the imagery and term have next to nothing to do with those people who are today know as Native Americans. Did somebody actually use the word "genocide?" More with the inflammatory language. If smallpox and about a dozen other since eradicated diseases are "genocide" (holding back chuckles), then that is certainly what happened to hundreds of thousands of Indians. (Those diseases had severe effects on other populations all over the globe, by the way.) For details, see the Indian population estimates authored prior to the rise of American anti-Europeanism (a form of racism itself). It's laughable that somebody would suggest Americans may not be informed about Indian history when it's clear that they themselves have not read anything beyond the politically-motivated pollution of the past 50 years. I'm not sure why Asian stereotypes would have a valid place in this discussion (they don't) but I am nevertheless amused to see someone suggest that the attitudes of her Asian friends would imply anything. Didn't you just get done telling us that what one Native American believes is not representative of what another Native American may believe? Secondly, if you ever come across someone who assigns a positive trait to you for reasons that are not rational (this happens all the time -- it's called the halo effect), smile and thank them. Then thank them again. Only in America would some jackass complain because people are assigning them admirable qualities for the wrong reasons. Unbelievable. With respect to the students being offended; nobody was offended before one student decided to make a stink. A bandwagon effect quickly manifested itself after one freak shook loose from the woodwork. A student could have complained about the lack of hot fudge sundaes in the cafeteria and, given sufficient attention by a media portraying the grievance as legitimate, there would have been students falling right in line. (No fudge! No peace! How inspiring!) We're teaching our students the wrong thing; they should be taught that you don't get to change your external environment based on what offends you. Moreover, throw out the ADHD meds and stop being offended!

Loud Whispers

What do you think? : 3/31/2009

Oh the nostalgia for the days when racist meant something...like when we had white hoods and burning crosses in this country, When we slaughtered Indians at Sand Creek and Wounded Knee. When we forced tribes to trade their recognized national status for US citizenship. When we "allocated" their own land to them and sold off the rest to white ranchers and held the lease money in "trust." When we promised impoverished reservation residents with job training and employment in urban areas if they left their ancestral homes. When traditional native religion was illegal to practice on a tribes own land until 1978. Oh, those were the good ol' days when racism was black and white and it was easy to condemn it. All this stuff about how the only common portrayal of Indians today is as a savage warrior or a passive mourner of environmental degradation, that's not racist. Waah! All those statistics about how Indian reservations are described as the Fourth World (like the Third World within the First) and how most tribes, even most with casinos, are unbearably poor, that the suicide rate among Indian teens is 4 times the national rate, that indigenous languages are disappearing, that the high school dropout rate among Indians is twice that of the national average. I mean, who cares about all that? That's not someone calling them racial slurs or violently attacking them. So it can't be racist can it? I mean, it's not like racism can evolve. it's not like it could look a certain way in the Jim Crow South and look a different way in 2009. That's just ludicrous! Racism has to mean one thing and one thing only and I get to decide what it means and the rest of you are just whiners if you say that any racial minority deserves a chance to voice dissent to ways that society still manifests racism, in positive stereotypes like all black people are good at basketball (but not chess), or all Asian-Americans are good at math (but not punk rock), or all Indians are the legacy of warriors who bravely, violently resisted European colonization (but not Indian enough to speak out against offensive images). Gosh people, can't we just act like all white people belong here and there's no illegitimate violence in our history. I mean what's the big deal?

;)

Peace is the way : 10/9/2009

I din't see the images but I did read numerous articles about fight and majour upset those images have caused on both sides... Now I am not about to take either side of the argument but one thing is pussling me. Death threats to children, bullying of teenagers and racial tensions are not a good thing in any argument. I see people as people regardless of their believes, race or interests - what I see here is people who turn violent in the name of the very thing that was supposed to connect them. I wish well to both sides and wish them to find peace with each other.

Elaine Jacobi