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Save of City from the City Officals and Staff : 1/29/2009

I support the points that are made by Cheri Rae, who is well know in this community as a reasonable voice advocating for the protection of the City we love and cherish. The City has not been able to demonstrate that this intersection is dangerous. The neighbors have been asking for signs and improvements to the crosswalks not a total meltdown of a well functioning intersection

mouse

De la Vina "Y" : 1/29/2009

Like egg, "if ain't broke don't fix." Once again staff and council want to steal victory away from the citizens. Staff admits to greater congestion that will lead to Samarkand increased cut through traffic, increased pollution, and more noise. Ms. Rae quotes great facts as to historical relevance and safety. Reminder the residents and businesses twice rejected congesting De la Vina and State, and have signed in huge numbers multiple petitions against the City's traffic plans for the area. Save the "Y"!

Peabody school graduate-San Roque native

: 1/29/2009

Chere does not ride a bike very much, especially at that intersection.

Y Bother fixing something that's not broken? : 1/29/2009

Cheri Rae has done it again: exposed other ridiculous and ridiculously expensive city boondoggle. Apparently there's a surplus of city planners with time on their hands to dream up these make-work projects and a distinct shortage of critical thinking. This project shouldn't have got past the pencil on a napikin over lunch planning stage, much less spending tens of thousands of dollars to advance this turkey. The intersection that really needs fixing is the one between scarce taxpayer dollars and the bureaucrats who squander it.

JS Chase

: 1/29/2009

The same ostriches here opposed the widened sidewalks on State Street when downtown still was four lanes wide and lined with car parking with a sidewalk barely wide enough for two people. Breathe deeply.

Longing for Bakersfield by the Sea

The tree in the wye : 1/29/2009

My friend Mike Pahos, who served our City and County parks departments for many years, and holds much institutional knowledge apparently not readily available to today's staff, offered the following insight about the planting of the tree, which is more recent than I had been led to believe. With thanks to Mike, here's his commentary: "I have been watching the ABR discussions on this project..they did not like what they saw...but the "tree story" is not correct...in fact the real story is more fun...that tree was planted back in the 60's when I was City Park Supt....we started a program to plant trees "visually significant" to our city landscape but that were too large for people to plant in their own yards...so the plan was to find public spaces where the city could plant these trees to assure preservation of our unique skyline....that triangle was a good spot because it was big enough to take a large tree, and also because a tree there would screen the buildings on State St. when you drive up De La Vina."

Cheri Rae

Wye NOT ! : 1/30/2009

Once again, 'someone' is proposing to fix something that already works fine and in fact is a unique crossroad in this city's layout. In addition to the direct squandering of funds that could be put to better use, this will create hardship for all who will have to negotiate and navigate through it for the extended period of time it will ultimately waste. What are these 'representatives' thinking? If they had to pay for this with their own money, would they think they're getting value out of it? Are they considering the people they represent? How about closing car traffic on State Street downtown from Victoria Street down to Haley Street and making it a pedestrian and bike thoroughfare with community vegetable gardens. This could benefit everyone and put our funds to better use...

M Schusteff

Save the WYE : 1/30/2009

Thanks for a well-written and infomative piece on a subject I previously dismissed out of hand, like it was just the 'way things are'. I hope the city will realize the folly of this project and can it for good, especially considering the history of this intersection. There are more important things to be done with that money!

Analog

De la Vina Intersection : 1/30/2009

J.S. Chase has it correct when he/she says "The intersection that really needs fixing is the one between scarce taxpayer dollars and the bureaucrats who squander it." But unless a large number of people (i.e. votes) show up at the City Council meeting in opposition to this, it will probably be approved.

Art

Still no tears for Cherie Rae : 1/30/2009

When I take into account this intersection's problems I am in agreement that this intersection needs improvement. The sling or hurl effect of this free-right turn has long been a complaint for motorists and pedestrians alike. Crossing this de la Vina and Samarkand Drive intersection perhaps was a breeze when there was little traffic in 1938. Increasing numbers of cars has made this intersection impossible to use and unfairly redirects traffic to other intersections. Ms. Rae and Mr. de Forest's seems to lament the antiquated "grid" system street design in favor of the modern highway and arterial system. What both Rae and de Forest do not acknowledge is that arterials and this "wye" intersection favors concentrated high speed traffic motorized through traffic with many drawbacks for cross traffic, pedestrians and cyclists. The downside to correct this design to this is the cost to repair it.

Don McDermott

Dismanteling a good intersection : 1/30/2009

Cheri Rae is right on. The sad truth is that City officials and staff don't understand what makes Santa Barbara special and are bit by bit turning us into just another congested place. Even sadder is the fact they don't listen to those trying to protect the beautiful spot.

mouse

I can think of a lot of other ways to spend $750,000! : 1/30/2009

Howabout 1. reviewing all the red zone curbs in the city that seem to have no purpose. OR, 2. repainting all the curbs that are faded or multi-colored to the point that you are not quite sure what kind of zone you are in, OR 3. changing the parking signs so they tell you that the restriction does not apply on Sunday! This is "Y" boon-doggle is a perfect example of the transporation dept dreaming up ways to spend our $ on their pet projects. I hope everyone who cares about how SB's revenue is spent will show up at the City Council meeting on Feb 10 at 6pm to express their outrage at this ridicuous waste of money.

Peter N

Cheri and the Wye - an accident waiting to happen : 1/30/2009

There are so many false statements in Cheri's editorial that it is hard to decide where to begin. It's not that she's lying - she just has not bothered to learn what the truth is. Here are the facts: THE CITY IS NOT PROPOSING TO GET RID OF THE "Y" INTERSECTION AT STATE & DE LA VINA. There will still be a Y intersection there no matter what the City does or does not do. The primary purpose of the proposal is to design the Y so that the free right turn lane from State onto De La Vina is eliminated - because it is incredibly hazardous to cyclists and pedestrians. THE PROBLEMS ASSOCIATED WITH THE FREE RIGHT TURN LANE ARE NOT UNIQUE TO STATE & DE LA VINA. The Caltrans Highway Design Manual, The design guidelines of The American Association of State Highway and Transportation Officials, and the Institute of Transportation Engineers' street design guidelines all caution against the establishment of free right turn lanes in urban areas where pedestrians and bicyclists are likely to be found. The City of Santa Barbara's own design standards are based on these documents and, accordingly, the free right turn lane at State & De La Vina could not be built there today. NUMEROUS LOCAL GROUPS HAVE COMPLAINED FOR YEARS ABOUT THE FREE RIGHT TURN LANE. These include community groups based in the neighborhood, the Coalition for Sustainable Transportation, the Bicycle Coalition and others. CITY COMMITTEES AND CITY STAFF HAVE IDENTIFIED THE FREE RIGHT TURN LANE TO BE HAZARDOUS. This includes the Police Department, the Public Works Department and Transportation and Circulation Committee OTHER GOVERNMENTAL AGENCIES HAVE DETERMINED THE FREE RIGHT TURN LANE TO BE HAZARDOUS. This includes the Santa Barbara County Association of Governments and the California State Transportation Commission - which gave the City $750,000 through a competitive process to help pay for getting rid of the free right turn lane. THERE IS NO RECORD OF A PEDESTRIAN OR CYCLIST BEING SERIOUSLY INJURED AT THIS FREE RIGHT TURN. This is the only fact that is subject to change, and if and when it does: TODAY'S FACT ARE TOMORROW'S EVIDENCE. If the free right turn remains, and the $750,000 disappears, the City will be in a difficult position if and when a pedestrian or cyclist is injured or killed at State & De La Vina. The personal injury lawyers can easily prove that the City knew there was a problem, developed a plan to solve the problem, and even obtained funding to solve the problem. They'll be knocking on the City Attorney's door, and he'll tell the City Council in closed session to settle the lawsuit out of court - for serious money. Then, after the $750,000 has been allocated somewhere else and the citizens of Santa Barbara have paid an unnecessary 7 figure out of court settlement, we'll go through this whole process once again and the free right turn lane will be finally eliminated. CHERI, IS THIS WHAT YOU WANT?

Wet Willy

De La Vina Wye : 1/31/2009

Cheri, I think you have it exactly right here. Can you cover the Council meeting Tuesday, Feb. 10 at 6 PM in City Hall where they will decide what to do? Frank Hotchkiss

Frank Hotchkiss

ride a bike and learn : 2/1/2009

If this intersection gets a stop light, I no longer will be able to take the curving turn at 50 mph anymore in my Bimmer like Frank Hotchkiss does.

de la vina Y : 2/2/2009

Does a traffic light or a stop sign at the "free right turn lane" cost $750,000?

Penny

De La Vina "Y" : 2/4/2009

I agree with Cheri Rae completely. Her points are practical and well thought out. Santa Barbara is being destroyed as fast as possible by the people in charge. Do not waste time, materials and beaucoup cash we cannot afford to waste - ruining a marvelous intersection - to create something we will all curse and despise on a daily basis! Shirley

More whining about any decision the city makes : 2/4/2009

Good grief, Cheri. You'd think they were tearing down both the Mission AND the Courthouse to put in a freeway, from the way you carry on. Despite the crazy use of all caps and run-ons, I think Wet Willy is right on. Try being a pedestrian or cyclist on that part of State/DLV for just one week and see what kind of tune you whistle. Consider it a challenge. One week.

allegro805

De la Vina wye : 2/5/2009

The City Council's rush to ruin yet another intersection with a million dollar remodel demonstrates conclusively that they are a gang of asses and fools. Then again, maybe they represent a majority of city residents, since only asses and fools would vote such turkeys into office in the first place.

43 year motorist

Nope : 2/9/2009

Sorry Cheri. Accidents are subject to ups and downs from statistics. The free right turn at State into De La Vina has been lucky, but when you look at the hundreds of other free right turns in California and the US, you learn that they are dangerous. It is broke... very broke, and good thing the conscientious and well-educated city staff has figured out how to fix it.

Andretti

Why we need to replace the "Y" with a" T" and get a $750,000 stimulus gift from the State of California : 2/9/2009

I agree with Wet Willy. This intersection is a good use of public transportation funds from the State that will go away if not spent on Safety improvements at De la Vina and State Street. This intersection is dangerous to pedestrians and eastbound bicyclist and needs a safety improvement NOW! The city counsel will weigh in on this on Tuesday Night 2-10-2009 and needs to hear from all citizens interested in making bicycling and walking safer at this intersection. Please plan to attend or send an email today to support safety at De la Vina and State

Jamey

De La Vina Wye : 2/9/2009

Who says it isn't broken? Is it not broken because no one has been killed there yet? I have ridden my bike through that intersection and it scares me. I don't want to be the first fatality. I think Cheri needs to open her eyes and take note that there are more and more bicyclists on our streets. For those who lament the change in the Santa Barbara lifestyle, I didn't realize that part of the lifestyle included the ability to maintain a high speed as one shoots through that intersection on to De La Vina. I have a slightly different spin on the lifestyle here -- the ability to do outdoor activities year round like jogging, cylcing, hiking and other things to keep my physically fit during my senior years.

MK

death waiting to happen : 2/9/2009

so shall we wait for a few people to die before we correct this hazard?

cynic9

Let's get this thing fixed : 2/9/2009

Good debate, neighbors. I am a nearly full-time cyclist and also a on the Bicycle Coalition board. So my bias is for safe roads for all users. I feel very unsafe when I try to cross the DLV "Wye." Do I want it fixed? You bet! When I do use the family car to drive on State Street, I don't expect an autobahn experience. I expect to putter along and enjoy the marvelous views. These views are even nicer when they don't include firetrucks and ambulances. Let's make this into a safer intersection and move on to the next, good project. This is why I pay taxes. Thanks to all who are civil around this issue. Don Lubach

Don Lubach, Cyclist and slow driver

It's a freeway onramp between a park and a coffee shop : 2/9/2009

How Cheri Rae, the walk Santa Barbara author and my former neighboor in the upper eastside where there are no free right turn 'on-ramps' next to parks could endorse such an unsafe and anti-pedestrian stance is crazy. Anyone with children who play in MacKenzie park, or who HAS EVER WALKED IN THE UPPER STATE NEIGHBORHOOD knows the obvious danger of the intersection. The city has secured state funding to improve this intersection, and it would be crazy to throw away all the work of the Public Works, Fire, and Police departments in order to please those who are out of touch with reality.

Local walker, biker, and driver

Does someone have to be injured or die to justify a change? : 2/10/2009

I don't see the need for a death or injury to justify a change. As a bicycle rider and an auto user, I see the danger it poses when one needs to continue on State Street. I do not see a historical value to the shape of a street, but a hazard.

Beth

Make the change already! : 2/10/2009

This intersection is broken and I can't imagine that we need to wait for a fatality to prove it. As mentioned by several others, a Y intersection would not be allowed today because they are unsafe in urban areas, which this is. The lack of accidents does not mean that this is not a risky intersection for peds and bikes. As we have heard from handfuls of people at all the previous meetings, pedestrians and cyclists AVOID this intersection because it IS so unsafe, myself included. But let us not forget that the proposed improvements will improve the safety for all of us: pedestrians, cyclists, AND motorists. All users need to be protected, especially the most vulnerable. Let's get on with it.

Use it or Lose it : 2/10/2009

This isn't an issue of "saving" the money for a different project: most of the money is coming from the state and federal government and this project is not competing with other local projects or needs. My understanding is that the $750,000 must be spent on safety improvements that have been approved along De la Vina, or the money may be reassigned and Santa Barbara will lose it. As a cyclist and someone worried about unemployment in this county, I'll happily take a safer Santa Barbara and not send the money back.

Wye? : 2/12/2009

In no other City would it be considered to spend close to a million dollars so I bicyclist doesn't have to dismount, look over his shoulder, and walk across the street especially in a time when tax dollars are at a premium

Aaron Shaw

Tax waste : 2/12/2009

Gotta love the "I pay taxes therefore I am entitled to have my way" attitude of Don Lubach. Guess what Don? Other people that don't agree with you, also pay taxes and most of them feel this is a waste of tax money, regardless of whether it comes from the state, or the county or the feds. I am tired of the "we have to use the money or lose it" attitude. We have to spend tax money , hold our hands out for bailout money, just because it is available? We have to spend it?? No wonder the state and the country are going bankrupt. Let's be efficient with tax dollars. Spending a million bucks because some bicyclists can't look over their shoulder before doing something risky, or are too lazy to dismount and walk their bike and cross someplace safer is simply a waste of money that could be used somewhere more important. I'm tired of cyclists dictating public policy and wasting our money. I'm also tired of looking out for their safety because they are too stupid to look out for their own.

Miffed